Portal talk:Japanese/Archive 1

General
Balloonguy 20:02, 7 November 2006 (UTC) -- I hope I did this right, if I haven't please correct my errors. The Japanese wikibook has a lot of useful things we could use, including some lessons.

Balloonguy 00:06, 17 November 2006 (UTC) -- We should consider how to apply the The Wikiversity model for online learning to this.

Topic vs. stream
Xlbnushk 21:36, 7 November 2006 (UTC) -- I brought this issue up on the Japanese stream page, too, but what's the difference in purpose between the topic page and the stream page?


 * Balloonguy 00:15, 9 November 2006 (UTC) -- According to Naming_conventions topic pages are:


 * "Pages in the topic namespace are meta-discussion pages to help Wikiversity participants plan the development of main namespace educational content. Educational content such as lessons do NOT go in the topic namespace. ... Link from "Topic:" namespace pages to educational resources that are on main namespace pages."


 * And stream plan is:


 * "A collection of learning projects about a particular topic."


 * And a learning project is basically the "course", in this case learning japanese. So, in the stream there should be link to the course. In the topic page there should be coordination information and in the Japanese page, which does not exist yet, is where your course information and lessons should go.


 * Xlbnushk 06:12, 10 November 2006 (UTC) -- Let me get this straight... The Topic:Japanese page is for coordinating the development of Japanese language courses. The Japanese stream page is for collecting and organizing the various courses. (I use "course" here to mean a set of lessons. For example, a basic reading course would contain individual lessons about hiragana, katakana, and kanji.) What would be the purpose of the plain old Japanese page?


 * Balloonguy 19:06, 11 November 2006 (UTC) -- I think this is correct, the correct term for course in wikiversity is a learning project. The plain japanese page was an accident. I had created the page thinking there would only be one japanese learning project which I now know would not be practical.

Lessons
Balloonguy 02:05, 9 November 2006 (UTC) -- I have just created the Introduction to Japanese learning project page. Please fix any errors and add any additional information. By looking at the course plan that Xlbnushk has listed on the stream page, the kana lessons could be imported from wikibooks.

Balloonguy 20:54, 19 November 2006 (UTC) -- You are right, the introduction should contain historical, cultural and liguistical information.

Categories
Xlbnushk 02:10, 10 November 2006 (UTC) -- Japanese fits into the following category:


 * Category:Japanese

All Japanese articles should have this category at the bottom.


 * Balloonguy 03:14, 10 November 2006 (UTC) -- I have added the categories listed above to Introduction to Japanese and to Japanese stream

Xlbnushk 20:42, 10 November 2006 (UTC) -- UPDATE. Articles should only be placed in the category that is its immediate parent. Japanese articles go ONLY in Category:Japanese. The rest should be left to the hierarchy. Category:Japanese will then go into Category:Foreign Language Learning and so on.

Discussion format
Xlbnushk 06:12, 10 November 2006 (UTC) -- I think it would be best to put your name in bold in front of your comment like this so that it will be easier to tell who's saying what and when the speaker (writer) changes. I've updated what we've got so far to fit this format. If you don't like it, I can change it back. Any thoughts?


 * Balloonguy 19:26, 11 November 2006 (UTC) -- I agree it is easier to tell who's saying what but this seems to be a change in policy about talk pages, it should be officialy proposed. Help:Talk page has a method for formatting comments on a talk page. See Help:Talk page and Colloquium

Course Map
Balloonguy 22:32, 11 November 2006 (UTC) --The course map should go on the stream page so that people can see what the stream plan actually leads to.

Balloonguy 02:07, 14 November 2006 (UTC) -- What is the purpose of the Introduction to Japanese page? I had intended it to be the meta learning project what the Japanese stream page says is the beginner course and integrated lessons which includes writing and speaking. Right now it looks as if it is a learning project for learning key grammatical concpets and some basic vocabulary is If the lessons are to be seperated into seperate components I think that would be okay since I don't quite understand how that would work out.


 * Dnjkirk 16:36, 14 November 2006 (UTC) -- Nobody was doing anything on the page, so I stuck something in. Move it if you don't want it there.


 * Balloonguy 20:49, 15 November 2006 (UTC) --- It is not that I don't want it there, I guess I am asking is that we should formalize the course map like the japanese wikibook did in Japanese/Practical_Lessons


 * Xlbnushk 19:56, 19 November 2006 (UTC) -- I am totally blown away. I just looked through Japanese, and feel utterly dwarfed. Yes, that should definitely be our ultimate goal. How about this? Let's create a map of the various pages available there, take the discussion into account, and come up with an overall course map. That should be the #1 priority and should be done before we start making lessons.


 * Balloonguy 20:52, 19 November 2006 (UTC) -- I created a section to list pages the could be useful from the Japanese wikibook. There are a lot of pages on the wikibook, but there are a lot of redundant stuff on it as well, so let's get to work mining for data! Also, the way Tae Kim introduces grammer on Guide to Japanese Grammer is very good. We could also use the order in which Tae Kim introduces kanji and since Tae Kim licensed the guide under Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike 2.5 we can use the exercises as well.


 * Balloonguy 01:03, 14 December 2006 (UTC) -- I have created finished the Introduction to Japanese learning project since that was not under debate and I am in the process of creating a Japanese writing system learning project since this is also not under debate. After I finish this, we need to make a course map about how vocabulary and grammar should be taught. Two ideas I have is to have sample conversations about different situtations and have students learn vocabulary and grammar through immersion or have it so students learn the language from basic grammar up with vocabulary thrown in in order to have the exercises make sense, like how Guide to Japanese Grammer is organized i.e. it starts out teaching about existance and introduces vocabulary with the exercises.

Balloonguy 01:13, 31 December 2006 (UTC) -- I have finished finding pages on our sister projects, we should start discussing the course map now.

Material from wikibooks
Balloonguy 00:03, 25 November 2006 (UTC) -- I listed the material I found from wikibooks. I think I got them all. I know, the list is in pitifull state, it needs to be organized, which I will do later, feel free to organize the pages.

Xlbnushk 06:10, 26 November 2006 (UTC) -- Hey, awesome job with that. I'm dropping by to say that I'm going to be gone for a while... I've got a lot of things lined up right now. I'll be busy for several weeks, after which I will most likely be without an internet connection. So, no telling how long it'll ultimately be. I'll stop by occasionally, though, to see how things are going. Sorry about the sudden disappearance.

Balloonguy 22:22, 17 December 2006 (UTC) -- I've organized Topic:Japanese/Materials and have created Topic:Japanese/Materials/Wikiversity and Topic:Japanese/Materials/Wikibooks to list materials found at the respected locations.

Firefox Language packs
Where can I get language packs for Firefox? This is not off topic. Maybe it should go in a FAQ or something. How can I use the materials without it!? --Remi0o 22:41, 17 December 2006 (UTC)

If you are asking how to display Japanese text then Computing in Japanese, if you are asking to change the firefox interface so that labels for the buttons and stuff are in japanese and you have firefox 2.0 then ‎

Furigana
I found a template in wikibooks that allows you to put furigana. I have put it in my sandbox to test. I have used it in Computing in Japanese, check it out. The problem with the template is that it does not allow the page to validate. CSS3 has support for ruby text, does anyone know how to do this?--Balloonguy 23:20, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Furigana
Created Template:Ruby-ja --Balloonguy 00:43, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Japanese Characters
Is there someone who can create a template which contains: "The following learning projects use Japanese characters. Please check your computer's capabilites here.", to warn users about Japanese text.--Balloonguy 00:59, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Course Map
Anybody have an idea on how we should go about this?--Balloonguy 22:47, 19 January 2007 (UTC)

So far Introduction to Japanese has been created which teaches kana and basic information. Beginner Japanese has lessons containing basic grammar such as verbs and adjectives. Now to proceed I was thinking that lessons could now be about a situation which would teach vocabulary about the situation and grammar related to it, but I do not know what possible learning activites can be related to it. One learning activity that is possible is to translate articles for Wikipedia but that would be an advanced level activity. Another activity is to make stroke order diagrams for kanji and another is to make wiktionary entries for requested words. But the first one requries knowledge of a graphics program and the second requires the ability to get a japanese dictionary. Any thoughts?--Balloonguy 17:38, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

well i think "bunkei" sentence patterns should be included as they are the part of JLPT (all levels).Secondly picture comprehensions should also be included as it helps in better undersatnding of situation and give learners a better insight of the subject.--ParagParag 06:38, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Can you explain what a bunkei sentence patterns sentance problem is, that is something I am not familiar with. And also, what level of the JLPT are you studying for?--Balloonguy 21:21, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

Japanese/Practical_Lessons has a well thought out lesson plan. The French Japanese Wikibook also has good stuff we can use.

JLPT
It might be a good idea to make jlpt learning project in which participants make a guide book.--Balloonguy 17:38, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Changes
I hope nobody mines the new look of the topic page. It is based off the design of Topic:Spanish.--Balloonguy 20:58, 28 March 2007 (UTC)