Talk:Wittgenstein reading group

I will be reading both english and german
My native language is dutch and my english and german are nearly as good. Since Wittgenstein was a german writer, i think it would be best to read him in german. I will look at the english text as well for the discussions. Perhaps some german words are multi-interpretable, which can't be translated in english. I miss both the in-depth recognition of english and german, since i am dutch, so the meaning of some words will be missed to me, regardless of which language will be used.--Daanschr 10:14, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

English link on this reading group
Cormac,

The english text is missing the introduction and the quote in the beginning of the book.

I like this text immediately. The quote says: Überhaupt hat der Fortschritt das an sich, daß er viel größer ausschaut, als er wirklich ist. NESTROY I don't know who NESTROY is. My english translation is: Of course progress seems much larger than it is for real. This quote could be interpreted in many ways. What is progress? Why do people believe in something which is smaller than it seems?--Daanschr 10:21, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

What is being missed in my translation is that progress is a person in this quote. Progress is he instead of it. He seems larger than he is for real. Something untranslatable is that it is the progress. In english you can't say the progress seems bigger. So, here we have the first difference in language between english and german.--Daanschr 10:24, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

Perhaps the male form is used because the word progress (Fortschritt) is male in german. In dutch we always say it for concepts, except when describing people or horses.--Daanschr 10:31, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

I think this is NESTROY.--Daanschr 10:35, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

I just read the introduction and i must say that i was wrong to give too much attention to the difference between english and german. The minor details that exist between languages are nothing compared to the differences between views.--Daanschr 11:14, 15 February 2008 (UTC)


 * I wouldn't disregard details between languages as minor - in fact, most English translations of Philosophical Investigations have a page in English (ie translation) facing the original German text on the mirror page. In any case, what do you mean by the "differences between views"? Also, I should say Daan, I might not get around to starting reading this until at least next week - I've another few readings to get through first. ;-) Cormaggio talk 15:17, 15 February 2008 (UTC)


 * I'd strongly recommend using one of the German/English versions, because he definitely plays word games while describing language games. I took a class on the Investigations in grad school, but will probably have to sit this out because it's a bit too large of an undertaking for me now. --SB_Johnny | talk 17:37, 15 February 2008 (UTC)

I was reading parts of the text already, so we can better wait untill you (Cormac) have read the text as well. (I shouldn't have started on my own ;-)--Daanschr 10:24, 16 February 2008 (UTC)


 * Well, I certainly don't want to dampen your enthusiasm. :-) I think it's fine for you to go ahead and make notes and comments (perhaps on subpages), and then I can comment on your comments, make my own observations, etc. I think that's the way the Illich reading group has worked so far... Cormaggio talk 15:36, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

The Illich reading group is going too slow to my taste. I prefer a structured discussion.--Daanschr 17:23, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

I don't know how much time i will have in a few months. At the moment i have a job which requires little work, but it will probably change. I will be forced to leave this reading group when my work will require too much of my time. I am sorry for that. I choose to stay on the Thucysdides group, because i started that one earlier. I don't know how active i will be when i have a new job.--Daanschr 17:25, 16 February 2008 (UTC)